Share
Go down
avatar
Admin
Posts : 1153
Join date : 2018-01-02
Age : 23
Location : The Moon
View user profile

Re: No Longer Afraid

on Mon Oct 15, 2018 11:25 am
The mug looked at his double, eyes wide at his words. He turned his gaze back to the pair that were hiding. Even so slowly, he began to make his way towards him. If they needed help, then they'd surely give it to them. He could clearly see that the Mugman that was hiding with the new Cuphead looked really scared. The sight caused his heart to ache. He knew that look all too well.

Ruka paused for a brief moment. He looked back at the others down below. They didn't look like demons. They didn't look like they were threats. His eyes widened when he noticed Azure making his way towards them and he pointed at his approaching double. Guess the discussion was already made for them.

_________________
The woods are now alive.
avatar
Admin
Posts : 83
Join date : 2018-10-12
Age : 18
Location : Fuck if I know
View user profile

Re: No Longer Afraid

on Mon Oct 15, 2018 11:30 am
Mugs nodded, following Azure up to the new pair, noticing just how- paranoid the other him looked. It broke his damned heart. He knew that look himself, from the bullies. He shot a glance at Azure, hoping he was okay. A look behind them showed Reed pulling Cuphead along to follow, telling the cup that there was no way in fucking hell they were doing this alone. The cats moved closer to the house, Hunter and Tsuki moving in front of their respective partners protectively.

Ward moved in front of Ruka, gently guiding his boyfriend behind him, seeming prepared for a fight at any time, though the look in his eyes made it clear that honestly? He was just as fucking scared as Ruka. He just was the guardian who couldn't hide. So he forced himself to look calm and brave.
avatar
Admin
Posts : 1153
Join date : 2018-01-02
Age : 23
Location : The Moon
View user profile

Re: No Longer Afraid

on Mon Oct 15, 2018 11:47 am
There was a sound of protest from Cuphead as he was being tugged to his feet by Reed. He stumbled after his double as he was pulled along to catch up with the two mugs. Truth be told, he was curious about these new doubles of theirs. They both looked frightened, but the Cuphead was trying to be brave for the Mugman that was hiding behind him. Understandable. It wasn't every day you met versions of yourself.

Angel and Arctic moved closer to the house as they noticed everything going down. They looked out from behind Hunter and Tsuki as they stood in front of them to protect them. The new Cuphead and Mugman didn't look like they meant trouble, but it was better to be safe then sorry. They knew that all too well.

Ruka glanced around Ward to see what was going on. He whined lightly. He hoped they wouldn't end up getting into a fight with these doubles. They were outnumbered and he wouldn't be able to help Ward if a fight broke out.

Azure bit his lip at the sight. He shared a look with Mugs for a moment before looking back at the new pair. He put his hands up to show that they didn't mean any harm once he saw the Cuphead gently push his Mugman back, standing in front of him to protect him from them.

_________________
The woods are now alive.
avatar
Admin
Posts : 83
Join date : 2018-10-12
Age : 18
Location : Fuck if I know
View user profile

Re: No Longer Afraid

on Mon Oct 15, 2018 12:01 pm
The ten year old stared at Azure, flinching slightly as he moved his hands, but he realized it was a sign of peace, not war, allowing him to relax slightly. Inhaling deeply, he exhaled after a good few minutes, looking around at all the doubles. They would all be Cuphead wouldn't they? Time for nicknames. "Okay. Assuming none of you are just tricking us. . . Hi. I'm Ward. That's Ruka. We have no idea where we are, considering a portal dropped us here out of nowhere." He explained carefully, still keeping his boyfriend behind him. Not yet trusting enough to allow him to come forward.

Mugman froze the minute Ward flinched, clearly nervous himself. But he also calmed, mostly distracted by the story. If that was true, Ruka must be damn close to a breakdown. He knew he would be if he was in the middle of that type of bullshit. "Well um. I'm Mugman, and this is Azure. Those two behind us are Cuphead and Reed. We aren't gonna hurt you too. Considering the same thing happened with Azure and Reed."

avatar
Admin
Posts : 1153
Join date : 2018-01-02
Age : 23
Location : The Moon
View user profile

Re: No Longer Afraid

on Mon Oct 15, 2018 12:14 pm
As soon as he heard the story, Azure felt pity. He knew all too well what that was like. He and Reed had been dumped out of a portal too into this world sometime ago. They had no idea how to get back to their own timeline so they ended up staying with Cuphead and Mugman. It wasn't like they had a place to live elsewhere in this timeline. He knew that Ruka was probably close to a breakdown by that alone, he was too when he first came here. Once his double introduced him, he waved in greeting at the pair.

Cuphead grumbled something under his breath before he nodded in greeting at the pair. Weird things happened all the time around Inkwell, but he never thought he'd be meeting more versions of himself and his boyfriend. World worked in odd ways sometimes.

Ruka relaxed only a little once he heard that they weren't going to be harmed. There was still distrust in the mug's eyes as he looked at the other four, as well as fear. It would take a while for him to trust them, even if they were himself and his boyfriend.

_________________
The woods are now alive.
avatar
Admin
Posts : 83
Join date : 2018-10-12
Age : 18
Location : Fuck if I know
View user profile

Re: No Longer Afraid

on Mon Oct 15, 2018 12:30 pm
Ward smiled at his doubles nervously, looking back at Ruka, who still seemed afraid. He moved slightly to a good spot to grab his hand, squeezing it lovingly. Smiling at him, before looking at the two people before him"N-Nice to meet you guys. Um. Do you have somewhere me and Ruka can rest up? We're kinda- tired from the trip. . ." It wasn't exactly a lie. It just- Wasn't exactly the truth. Ward knew they needed alone time. Too many new people, too much new things, too many things to face. He himself was on the edge of breaking down. It was too much to handle, too much to process.He was actually beginning to shake, though you couldn't tell unless you were touching him, as Ruka was.

Reed was staying close to Cuphead, just as nervous as him. But the look on Ruka's face was breaking his hard outside, making him want to go hug him. It looked so much like Azure that it hurt.

Mugs looked around and decided he would let Azure decide. He was okay with them staying, but they'd need to expand the house for damn sure, add more beds, or another bedroom. Since only Satan could really return these guys to their home.
avatar
Admin
Posts : 1153
Join date : 2018-01-02
Age : 23
Location : The Moon
View user profile

Re: No Longer Afraid

on Mon Oct 15, 2018 12:42 pm
Ruka flinched when he felt a hand suddenly grab his, a look of panic on his face, before he realized it was only Ward. He gripped his hand back in return just as lovingly, a hint of a smile on his face. But that quickly turned to a frown as he realized his Cuphead was shaking. He knew he was just as shaken up as he was. They were going to need time to get used to everything. This was too much at once. Too much to handle. Both of them were going to have a breakdown if this kept up.

Cuphead reached over, gripping Reed's hand in his own. He knew the look on his double's face. He felt that pain too. This new Mugman reminded him of his own and how scared he looked so many times for so many reasons. He already wanted to protect him just as he did Mugs and Azure. Ruka looked so much worse off. What the hell happened to this kid to make him so paranoid?

Azure took out his phone as he texted Satan. He asked if he could help make the house bigger since there were two new versions of him and Cuphead now. He didn't think sending Ward and Ruka back right away was a good idea. They needed time. Sending them back now would only make things worse he knew. And if they ended up staying here too? That was fine with him.

"I spoke to Satan... He um, made the house bigger so there's room for you both now," he responded, pocketing his phone after thanking the Devil for all his help.

_________________
The woods are now alive.
avatar
Admin
Posts : 83
Join date : 2018-10-12
Age : 18
Location : Fuck if I know
View user profile

Re: No Longer Afraid

on Mon Oct 15, 2018 12:53 pm
Noticing the bigger house in the background, he nodded. "Sorry to do this just after we met, but um. Me and Ruka are going to go sleep this off." Tugging lightly on Ruka's arm, he guided him towards the house, pausing at the number of cats in front of him. Smiling, he bent down, petting all but Tsuki, who moved straight to the blue mug, jumping on his shoulder, licking his face reassuringly, before walking off into the shadows, disappearing from view.
Once the cats let them pass, Ward opened the door, walking into the familiar, yet alien house. Spying a room that looked exactly like theirs in their own timeline, he made a beeline, Ruka in tow. Once inside, he shut the door behind him, leaning against it, struggling to keep whatever calm he had left intact. After a moment, he failed, sinking to the floor, shaking like he was out in a blizzard.

The curious twelve year old watched them enter the house. Once they vanished from view, he finally spoke up. "So. Um. We have more doubles from a timeline that appears to be a living hell, considering even we aren't that paranoid." Concern had invaded his tone, and he gripped Cuphead's hand tightly, grateful for it being there.
avatar
Admin
Posts : 1153
Join date : 2018-01-02
Age : 23
Location : The Moon
View user profile

Re: No Longer Afraid

on Mon Oct 15, 2018 1:05 pm
Ruka followed after him, glancing back at their doubles as they trailed pass them. He paused when he saw the group of cats. Angel and Arctic purred happily at the pets, nuzzling up against the pair happily. They could sense the fear they both had and wanted to help calm them down a bit. The mug's eyes widened when Tsuki suddenly jumped onto his shoulder, licking him in a reassuring way. He smiled as he reached out to lightly pet the black kitten.

Once inside, the twelve-year-old he followed Ward into the bedroom that was so familiar yet so alien to him. He watched as his Cuphead shut the door behind him before he ended up breaking down. Instantly he was by his side, holding him close.

Azure watched them head to the house, concern written all over his face. He was a bit surprised when Tsuki jumped onto his double's shoulder, licking his face before disappearing. Not long after that, they disappeared inside the house. Cuphead sighed as he held Reed's hand reassuringly. He knew his double was right. But what sort of fucked up timeline were they from?


"I think they're safer off here then goin' back ta whatever timeline they're from."

_________________
The woods are now alive.
avatar
Admin
Posts : 83
Join date : 2018-10-12
Age : 18
Location : Fuck if I know
View user profile

Re: No Longer Afraid

on Mon Oct 15, 2018 1:15 pm
The damn minute he had Ruka holding him, he began crying, clinging to his boyfriend, muttering quiet sorries, as he always did when he cried. He always felt bad crying in front of Ruka, because he felt like he was failing. Felt like he wasn't protecting him, or saving him. That his image was ruined. But that thought only made him cry even more, his grip tightening on his lover as he kept saying sorry on a loop, shaking. It was too much. He wanted to scream, get something out of his head, something. Anything. Too many pressures, too many things, too many things to do, too many things to protect Ruka from. He couldn't handle it, couldn't take the weight.

Mugs frowned at the house, rubbing the back of his neck, looking at Azure, pulling him closer, taking his hand as well, sighing as he nodded. Cuphead was right. What they needed was to stay here. At least until they could figure out what was happening to them, or what had happened in the past. "I agree. Ruka looks- Ruka looks ready to just disappear, if not for Ward. I've never seen someone so scared of everything in my life. I feel bad for him. . . And for Ward."
avatar
Admin
Posts : 1153
Join date : 2018-01-02
Age : 23
Location : The Moon
View user profile

Re: No Longer Afraid

on Mon Oct 15, 2018 1:25 pm
The mug just held his boyfriend close to himself. He nuzzled up against him, whining. He hated seeing Ward like this. He felt horrible for not being able to help him. To not be able to protect him like he did for him. Sure he has his own Gum, but that only got them so far. He kissed Ward gently, hoping to help calm him down some. Aside from that, he just let the cup cry. He knew that he needed this. Bottling his feelings up would only make this worse later.

Azure leaned up against Mugs once he was pulled closer, holding his double's hand gently, but tightly. He was afraid for Ruka and Ward. What Mugs and Cuphead said were true. He wanted to help them. They needed it badly.

"I don't think we should ask them questions anytime soon... If they're anything like Reed and I... They're going to need time to get used to this. We need them to trust us. If we start trying to get information, we're going to shatter what little we already have."

_________________
The woods are now alive.
avatar
Admin
Posts : 83
Join date : 2018-10-12
Age : 18
Location : Fuck if I know
View user profile

Re: No Longer Afraid

on Mon Oct 15, 2018 2:20 pm
"I'm sorry Ruka. I'm so sorry. I know I shouldn't be doing this, and I know it's not helping any, and it's probably making you feel worse, and I'm sorry, and I love you so much, please don't be upset-" He kept repeating those those phrases over and over, and things extremely similar to it.The kiss shut him up, even when the other pulled away. He now cried silently into Ruka's chest, struggling to even breath properly. If he kept this up, he would pass out on top of him. It was advised Ruka convince him to move to the bed before he was crushed.

"I agree. Considering that even now we have trouble telling each other whats wrong, even with the fuckin' honesty pact, there's no way in hell we're getting anything from them anytime soon. I wouldn't be surprised if they're in there crying from everything wrong with them." He stopped, blinking. He hadn't meant to rant that long about this, or even call them out on the crying. He just felt so overprotective, like a older brother protecting a younger sibling.
avatar
Admin
Posts : 1153
Join date : 2018-01-02
Age : 23
Location : The Moon
View user profile

Re: No Longer Afraid

on Mon Oct 15, 2018 7:10 pm
The mug gently tugged at him, pulling him to the bed and telling him to climb onto it. He knew what was going to happen now. He'd been there many times to know the signs of what was going to happen to his boyfriend. At least Ward would be asleep on a soft spot rather then the floor.

Cuphead and Azure looked at him at his words. They were both thinking the same thing, just Mugs beat them to it. The mug looked back at the house a small whine left him. If they were in the house crying, he felt even more bad for them. They didn't deserve that.

_________________
The woods are now alive.
avatar
Admin
Posts : 83
Join date : 2018-10-12
Age : 18
Location : Fuck if I know
View user profile

Re: No Longer Afraid

on Tue Oct 16, 2018 9:16 am
It took a good few tries for Ruka to get him to move. At first, he whined, clinging tighter to his boyfriend, not allowing himself to move. But as he began to drift off, he jumped, snapping awake with a start. Groaning softly as he finally allowed Ruka to move him over to the bed. The minute he was there, he crawled under the covers, pulling the mug with him, kissing his forehead gently, protectively. He was still quite guarded and protective, even breaking down and crying. "It's okay. We'll be okay. We have each other, and these doubles seem nice. Besides. There might be a way home. Okay? I love you. . ." He knew he wasn't the only upset one here. That Ruka might need to release his emotions too.

Reed had gone as quiet as Mugs in that instant, looking at Cuphead and Azure nervously, before shooting a glance at the house. "I hate it, but I think he's right. The Cuphead- Ward, looked ready to start screaming from stress, and Ruka just- I thought if I even touched him, he'd shatter in my hands. . . " He admitted softly, biting his bottom lip. Well, if they were admitting things-
avatar
Admin
Posts : 1153
Join date : 2018-01-02
Age : 23
Location : The Moon
View user profile

Re: No Longer Afraid

on Tue Oct 16, 2018 9:52 am
Ruka smiled slightly at him as he pulled him to the bed before he was pulled onto it with him. The mug nodded silently as he nuzzled his boyfriend happily. The elder male was having a hard time not breaking down but he was trying so hard to be strong for his boyfriend. One of them had to be one the other was breaking down. It was so difficult, but he was trying so damn hard. Ward needed him right now. Him breaking down wasn't going to help him.

"Love you...." he whispered in reply. "Sleep.. ....We'll be okay...."

Cuphead gripped tighter onto his double's hand at his word. He knew the look on Ward's face wanting to let all the stress out. The way Ruka looked... The utter terror on his face... The way he glanced back at them fearfully as he was pulled into the house.... It caused a tightness in his chest. He knew all those signs. He had lived through them once himself. It only caused that protectiveness to grow.

"We..." He cleared his throat before trying again. "We gotta do somethin' ta help 'em. They're us. We can't just stand around here doin' nothin'. They need space, I get that. But we also gotta show 'em we care and we're here for 'em. Just like we did for ya two when ya first came ta our world. But... We'll give 'em a little bit. We don't wanna scare 'em."

_________________
The woods are now alive.
avatar
Admin
Posts : 83
Join date : 2018-10-12
Age : 18
Location : Fuck if I know
View user profile

Re: No Longer Afraid

on Tue Oct 16, 2018 10:26 am
"Ruka- If you need to cry, go ahead. Okay? I mean. I'm going to pass out, like it or not it seems So if you wanted to, I'd never know?" He was trying to help. Struggling to help his boyfriend while also struggling not to completely break around himself. He needed help. He needed to help. He needed to be alone. He couldn't be alone. He was dying. He couldn't die. He could do this. He couldn't do it. The conflict was tearing him apart, forcing his body to shut down, before the worse happened. Ward passed out in Ruka's arm in the middle of speaking, unable to handle anything anymore.

Reed was shaking a little, looking over at Cuphead, eyes wide in concern, panic, and anxiety. He had no idea what Cuphead or Ruka had been through, but fuck. He knew they weren't okay. He knew he might not be okay. Azure couldn't be okay. And Mugs- He couldn't read him. His face was blank, missing any emotion as he stared at the house. He was barely even breathing.


"I- Fuck- Cuphead's right. Something needs to be done. I-" He cut himself off, knowing he was getting emotional. Too emotional. Too attached. Fuck. This is not what he wanted from any of this. He wanted to fix it, but he couldn't. . .
avatar
Admin
Posts : 1153
Join date : 2018-01-02
Age : 23
Location : The Moon
View user profile

Re: No Longer Afraid

on Tue Oct 16, 2018 10:42 am
Ruka gave a nod. Ward didn't even to finish what he was saying before he passed out. The mug nuzzled into his sleeping boyfriend as he allowed himself to cry silently. He knew that the cup wasn't going to wake up anytime soon after all that happened, but he still kept quiet, not wanting to take that chance to wake him up. He needed sleep so badly right now. 

Azure whined. He had no idea what Cuphead or Ruka went through but from the look on the cup's face right now and the look on his new double's face... It wasn't good. None of it was good. He stepped closer to Mugs. He had no idea what his double was thinking or feeling. His face was blank, unreadable. It was worrisome. It was scary.

Cuphead kept from meeting Reed's gaze. He could feel him stare to shake. He stepped closer to him, holding him close to attempt to calm him down.

_________________
The woods are now alive.
avatar
Admin
Posts : 83
Join date : 2018-10-12
Age : 18
Location : Fuck if I know
View user profile

Re: No Longer Afraid

on Tue Oct 16, 2018 10:59 am
Mugs jumped slightly when Azure drew closer, the movement shocking him from his own thoughts. Blinking a few times as he turned to look at Azure. His face was still quite blank, but certain emotions could now be seen. Concern. Worry. Anxiety. Empathy. Possibly pity. Guilt. The list went on. But he was trying to act the strong one. Reed was shaking, and looked ready to break down himself. Cuphead looked- Like he did the last time his parents came about. And Azure looked ready to worry himself into his grave. Someone had to pretend to be fine. Why not him?

The ten year old cup instantly accepted, falling into his arms, taking deep breaths to steady himself. He began to whisper, quietly so only Cup would hear him. "Cup. We- We can't wait for long. He's likely going to pass out from everything. But when he wakes up, it'll hit him hard- There's no way in hell Ruka would be able to handle that himself. We need to help him. The Mugs can handle Ruka."


Last edited by LostInTheMusic on Tue Oct 16, 2018 11:08 am; edited 1 time in total
avatar
Admin
Posts : 1153
Join date : 2018-01-02
Age : 23
Location : The Moon
View user profile

Re: No Longer Afraid

on Tue Oct 16, 2018 11:07 am
The mug hugged his double tightly--not enough to hurt him though. He buried his face up against him with a small whine. Everything was falling apart around them. His double was okay. Neither of the Cupheads were okay. No one was okay right now.

Cuphead held him close. He didn't say anything for a few moments before he gave a nod. He knew that Reed was right. The longer they waited, the worse it would be. He turned his attention to the Mugs' clearing his throat to get their attention.

_________________
The woods are now alive.
avatar
Admin
Posts : 83
Join date : 2018-10-12
Age : 18
Location : Fuck if I know
View user profile

Re: No Longer Afraid

on Tue Oct 16, 2018 11:12 am
Mugman looked down in shock as he was suddenly clung to. Honestly, he should've expected this. His arms folded around Azure, pulling him close, keeping him safe as he rubbed his back reassuringly. They stayed like that, peacefully, quietly, until Cuphead caught his attention. Blinking in surprise as the silence was broken by the sound.

After Cuphead cleared his throat, Reed detached himself from his boyfriend, though he kept a firm grip on his hand. But while he wasn't fine, he needed to maintain the illusion he was. He had seen how upset Azure was, which forced him into a protective mood, forcing him to hide and bury his negative feelings deep down where they would bubble over and burst later.
avatar
Admin
Posts : 1153
Join date : 2018-01-02
Age : 23
Location : The Moon
View user profile

Re: No Longer Afraid

on Tue Oct 16, 2018 11:27 am
Azure leaned into his embrace. He felt safe and secure with his double. He welcomed the silence that had fallen over the four of them, even if it was a bit unnerving. He jumped at the sudden notice when he heard Cuphead clear his throat. He pulled himself away from Mugs as much as he dared, turning his gaze onto the cups.

Cuphead squeezed his hand gently. He knew Reed was going to have a breakdown from this later. But he'd be there to support him and help him through it like he always did. Once he had everyone's attention, he explained the plan to them.

_________________
The woods are now alive.
avatar
Admin
Posts : 83
Join date : 2018-10-12
Age : 18
Location : Fuck if I know
View user profile

Re: No Longer Afraid

on Tue Oct 16, 2018 11:33 am
Listening to Cuphead as if his very life depended on it, he nodded, sighing deeply. "Okay. I agree, something needs to be done. But your plan has a flaw. Getting them away from each other in order to talk to them. Not to mention getting through the door. Smoke dashing makes us look bad. And we can only ask so many times. Not to mention, if you're right about Ward, it could take many hours for him to wake up. Do you have a backup for that?" He didn't mean to sound so against the plan. He truly was all for it. But he wanted it to work perfectly. Mistakes would not be okay here.

He'd survive. That's what he told himself at least. He honestly would force this breakdown to wait as long as he needed. Someone might need to coax it into happening, for his own health. Suddenly, a thought him at top speed, forcing him to release Cup's hand, eyes widening. "Guys. Ruka acts like Azure right? With the paranoia and anxiety? Does Ruka have his own- Well- Does he have his own gummy bear?" He figured they could pick up on the hint, realize what he was talking about.
avatar
Admin
Posts : 1153
Join date : 2018-01-02
Age : 23
Location : The Moon
View user profile

Re: No Longer Afraid

on Tue Oct 16, 2018 11:53 am
At the question, Azure's eyes widened as realization hit him. Ruka did act a lot like him. Only it seemed his anxiety and paranoia were a lot worse then his was. Or maybe it was the same, he had no idea. He never saw himself in that state before. The idea that someone shared his 'problem' made him happy. He wasn't the only one. Someone else understood what he was going through. There was one problem that caused the mug to frown.

"What if he's not aware of his Gum--if he even has one? Remember how scared I was whenever Gum let me back in control and I didn't remember anything since he knocked me out? Given Ruka's already panicked state right now... Wouldn't that make it worse for him if he woke up with no memories of what happened?" He knew for a fact it would fuck him up if he was in his double's shoes. He didn't want to scare Ruka anymore then he already was.

_________________
The woods are now alive.
avatar
Admin
Posts : 83
Join date : 2018-10-12
Age : 18
Location : Fuck if I know
View user profile

Re: No Longer Afraid

on Wed Oct 17, 2018 10:01 am
"We have to do something for them right? Like. Fuck. And when they wake up, how will we know? What do we do?" It was growing clear how bad this was affecting them all. Reed was starting to realize it himself. He began to shake again, fumbling for Cup's hand, before remembering he let it go on accident, which he pretended was fine, but it wasn't. He wasn't. His hand returned to him, and he forced it in his pocket.

Mugman was starting to get antsy., and he knew if he snapped, it wouldn't go over well. "Maybe. . . We need to pair off. . .And cool down. I think we're all getting too- Emotional about this. And the more emotional we get, the less we can help them out. ."
avatar
Admin
Posts : 1153
Join date : 2018-01-02
Age : 23
Location : The Moon
View user profile

Re: No Longer Afraid

on Wed Oct 17, 2018 10:16 am
Cuphead and Azure knew Mugs had a point. They were all getting too worked up themselves. They wouldn't be able to help Ruka and Ward like this. They needed to calm themselves down before they could even think about helping their new doubles. The duo nodded in agreement. It seemed as though it was time to pair off and relax. Then they could do their plan and help the newcomers with their problems. The cup reached over to take Reed's hand, glancing back at him. He gently tugged at his arm so they could split up for awhile. The mug looked back to his own double, awaiting for him to make the first move. It was up to him where he wanted them to go. He'd be fine with anywhere.

_________________
The woods are now alive.
Sponsored content

Re: No Longer Afraid

Back to top
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum